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Author Topic: What has happened to us?  (Read 25143 times)
hesprit
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« on: December 07, 2009, 11:42PM »



When I first found the Celtic Woman Forum, a couple years ago, I was thrilled to become a part of a group of people who wanted nothing more than to share our joy and love for an amazing group of performers.  People talked of the things we loved about Celtic woman, about the ladies as a group, about the indivicuals, about the music itself .. we shared our experiences, but most of all, we shared our support for those who were giving so much of themselves, for our benefit.

That has always been a standard here, to offer support, to enjoy what we've been given, and to encourage  the spread of Celtic Woman fans everywhere.

I'm sorry to say that I'm becoming discouraged lately.  More and more I keep reading threads and posts that are critical of CW Ltd and of the work being done.  Instead of enjoying the new show and the new DVD/CD it seems that people want to complain because they aren't done the way "WE" think they should be.

Folks, I'm sorry, but we are not the professionals here.  We don't know why some songs are left off and others are included, but we need to trust that there ARE reasons, and that these decisions are being made with the best interests of Celtic Woman as a whole in mind.

Another thought we should be considering, we know that members of Celtic Woman occasionally take a look at this forum, they sometimes read the things we are saying.  They do this because they are interested, they care about us, their fans.  Have we thought about the impressions we might be giving the girls with some of our comments?  One in particular, how might we be making Alex and Lynn feel, if they happen to read us talking about them being left out, or it appearing they are "lesser members" of the group?

I guess what I don't understand is the way it seems people have started to believe Celtci Woman, and more accurately, CW Ltd., must owe us something.  Why do we feel like we should be able to tell them what is right or wrong? 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying people shouldn't be able to express their opinions here, I just wonder if we are losing sight of the joys and pleasures that brought us all here in the first place.

Maybe this is just rambling, and maybe others don't see it the same way.  I just felt like it was a question that might help us.

Peter
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Life is Great!
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« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2009, 11:52PM »

I have a lot I could say about this post, but "AMEN" will just do for now.
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shankdee
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« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2009, 03:56AM »

 Cheesy Peter, you may have a point or two but your comments are along the line of the ones you are saying are not
    "right"...everyone is entitled to miss a song or two, and I don't think anyone here is trying to tell CW LTD what to do.
     Our moderators will remove any objectionable content in any thread which is not welcomed...I know becaue a
     comment or two of mine has been excoriated....with a very gentle explanation from a moderator.
     We all broke into applause when Lisa began to sing the "Voice " in Pasadena and it is sad to some of us that
     this song may be retired...THE VOICE is what has won over so many, many fans to C W.... I just finished
     reading a WONDERFUL review of an ORLA concert, a forum gathering, and even with pictures. I have only
     been on the Forum for one year....but I see all kinds of wonderful positve things...people who are willing
     to answer any question someone may have...So the group I am reading has nothing but praise and admiration
     and love for ALEX and Lynn, everyone I know is crazy about them and their incredible talent.  We are still loyal
     to Meav, Hayley, Diedre and Orla as it should be. I have learned so much about songs such as Mo Ghile Mear
     so much about Ireland, and kept up with current news..I think the forum rocks and that we have the
     BEST moderators to build upon our love and admiration for C W, and I felt tremendous support for the Isle of Hope
     Tour which recently ended....it was over ALL TOO SOON....
      I appreciate your viewpoint but I don't agree with all of it...Accentuate the Positive and Elminate the negative..!!!

shankdee
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Mel
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« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2009, 04:23AM »

Unfortunately Peter, this is a public forum, so anyone can come and post their opinions, good or bad.

I can't speak for everyone, but I know MOST of us are THRILLED WITH THE NEW SHOW!! I am!!! Yes wonder why some songs were dropped, but again, CW Ltd and even David may have a reason. Might not have fit with the show. I for one would love to at least have the song Have I Told You Lately on a CD, and hopefully they will still included it in the Tour of SFTH. But if not, I am not going to off in a huff and just drop my love of CW.

I also understand there are time constants with doing videos and Tours. You only have so much time and so  have to pick the songs that will be suit the show and tour. I can live that. I know others can too.

Those who keep condeming or being critical of CW Ltd are just spoiled, and what everything their way.

It AIN'T gonna happen people. It's not about one individual fan. It's about what will draw in EVERYONE!


As for THIS CW FAN...I AIN'T GOING NO WHERE...I AM IN THIS FOREVER!!!  Grin


Mel aka Troublemaker#1
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OldFatGuy
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« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2009, 08:21AM »

Moderating this forum is a difficult task, and that's the reason why we are so careful and selective about choosing moderators.  We allow some posts that might be seen as critical, while editing or deleting others.  But there's a method to our madness.

Some of our members have posted their issues with the actual presentation of the CW show; lighting, staging, gowns, song selection, solos or group numbers that were omitted (or included), etc.  As long as they are respectful, we believe CW has a right to hear these opinions.  They're in business to appeal to their fan base, and we represent that fan base.  What better place is there than a large fan forum for CW Ltd to tune in and get honest feedback from their paying clientele?  If anything, I feel they are almost obligated to take such criticism seriously.

But we draw the line at posts that are openly critical of the performers themselves.  They - the soloists, choir members and musicians - do read our posts, and they are human.  On more than one occasion I've learned that a performer's feelings were hurt by something that was said here.  We walk a fine line.  The producers can add a new solo if they want; it's far more difficult for the soloist to change her voice or her personality.  They are individuals with different talents and styles, and none of them are ever going to please every fan every night.  It's a matter of taste.  If you want to say that you enjoy Dougie MacLean's performance of Caledonia more than Lisa's, that's fine.  But if you want to say that Lisa doesn't have a good voice or stage presence, that's over the line and will probably be edited or removed.

Sometimes I miss the days when we were a small, rather intimate collection of a couple of hundred rabid fans and CW could do no wrong.  We are now a large and growing global community, and there are bound to be some wildly divergent opinions in a "group" with over 1800 members.  Originally, we had only the Helix concert and the first five soloists.  We loved the show and worshipped the girls.  Then along came ANJ and, for the first time, we had that dreaded word - change.  The set list changed.  Hayley was in, then she was out.  Méav was in, then she was out.  And there was much screaming and weeping and gnashing of teeth.  Now we've seen new songs, new gowns, new staging and *shudder* new performers.  Celtic Woman is a victim of their own success.  In order to pay their bills, they've had to add new songs and remove some of our old favorites.  They've had to replace some people who have chosen to go in a new direction.  As a result, they've given us a basis for comparison that we didn't have before.  And not all comparisons are going to be favorable.  That's life.

So here's your ground rule.  If you feel the need to post some constructive criticism about the CW production, we will probably allow it (as long as it's truly respectful and relevant; when in doubt, send one of us a PM).  But if you go after one of the girls - Alex, Chloë, Deirdre, Hayley, Lisa, Lynn, Máiréad, Méav and Órlagh - you are treading on very thin ice.  They are like family to us, and we will protect them like a mama lion protects her cubs.

Sorry if I rambled.  But Peter's candid and insightful post gave me a chance to air a few things I've had on my mind.  Thanks for reading.

Rich

off topic p.s.  If you feel your constitutional rights have been violated in any way - you signed away those rights when you agreed to be bound by our membership rules.  This forum is privately owned and administered, and you do not have the right to say anything you want, either in posts or in the chat room.
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Zo
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« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2009, 08:34AM »

Moderating this forum is a difficult task, and that's the reason why we are so careful and selective about choosing moderators.  We allow some posts that might be seen as critical, while editing or deleting others.  But there's a method to our madness.

So here's your ground rule.  If you feel the need to post some constructive criticism about the CW production, we will probably allow it (as long as it's truly respectful and relevant; when in doubt, send one of us a PM).  But if you go after one of the girls - Alex, Chloë, Deirdre, Hayley, Lisa, Lynn, Máiréad, Méav and Órlagh - you are treading on very thin ice.  They are like family to us, and we will protect them like a mama lion protects her cubs.

AMEN.  Constructive criticism is good for the soul but disrespectful criticism is only hallow and cheap. This is why we have the best monderators ever to watch out over the girls and watch out for all of us forum members. I have the greatest respect for them and they do a great job. If CW didn't change their songs now and again everyone would get bored with it. I like change...change is good  Cheesy  and they could sing Row, Row, Row Your Boat and I would love it!  Grin
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bobh56
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« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2009, 08:40AM »

Moderating this forum is a difficult task, and that's the reason why we are so careful and selective about choosing moderators.  We allow some posts that might be seen as critical, while editing or deleting others.  But there's a method to our madness.

Some of our members have posted their issues with the actual presentation of the CW show; lighting, staging, gowns, song selection, solos or group numbers that were omitted (or included), etc.  As long as they are respectful, we believe CW has a right to hear these opinions.  They're in business to appeal to their fan base, and we represent that fan base.  What better place is there than a large fan forum for CW Ltd to tune in and get honest feedback from their paying clientele?  If anything, I feel they are almost obligated to take such criticism seriously.

But we draw the line at posts that are openly critical of the performers themselves.  They - the soloists, choir members and musicians - do read our posts, and they are human.  On more than one occasion I've learned that a performer's feelings were hurt by something that was said here.  We walk a fine line.  The producers can add a new solo if they want; it's far more difficult for the soloist to change her voice or her personality.  They are individuals with different talents and styles, and none of them are ever going to please every fan every night.  It's a matter of taste.  If you want to say that you enjoy Dougie MacLean's performance of Caledonia more than Lisa's, that's fine.  But if you want to say that Lisa doesn't have a good voice or stage presence, that's over the line and will probably be edited or removed.

Sometimes I miss the days when we were a small, rather intimate collection of a couple of hundred rabid fans and CW could do no wrong.  We are now a large and growing global community, and there are bound to be some wildly divergent opinions in a "group" with over 1800 members.  Originally, we had only the Helix concert and the first five soloists.  We loved the show and worshipped the girls.  Then along came ANJ and, for the first time, we had that dreaded word - change.  The set list changed.  Hayley was in, then she was out.  Méav was in, then she was out.  And there was much screaming and weeping and gnashing of teeth.  Now we've seen new songs, new gowns, new staging and *shudder* new performers.  Celtic Woman is a victim of their own success.  In order to pay their bills, they've had to add new songs and remove some of our old favorites.  They've had to replace some people who have chosen to go in a new direction.  As a result, they've given us a basis for comparison that we didn't have before.  And not all comparisons are going to be favorable.  That's life.

So here's your ground rule.  If you feel the need to post some constructive criticism about the CW production, we will probably allow it (as long as it's truly respectful and relevant; when in doubt, send one of us a PM).  But if you go after one of the girls - Alex, Chloë, Deirdre, Hayley, Lisa, Lynn, Máiréad, Méav and Órlagh - you are treading on very thin ice.  They are like family to us, and we will protect them like a mama lion protects her cubs.

Sorry if I rambled.  But Peter's candid and insightful post gave me a chance to air a few things I've had on my mind.  Thanks for reading.

Rich

off topic p.s.  If you feel your constitutional rights have been violated in any way - you signed away those rights when you agreed to be bound by our membership rules.  This forum is privately owned and administered, and you do not have the right to say anything you want, either in posts or in the chat room.

Thank you, Rich.  I couldn't have said it better.  And, now that you did, I don't have to.

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edtom
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« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2009, 08:50AM »

Very well said Rich.
For the record: I like Songs From the Heart, and like it more and more each time I see it. I don't think it's unconstructive to say that I miss a couple songs that could (and I think should) be included.
I have been a member of this forum for almost two years now, and I try (not always successfully) to post only positive comments. Looking back, I can think of a few instances where I've said things that I wish I hadn't.
The bottom line: I love Celtic Woman, and I love all the cast members, past and present.
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zankoku
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« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2009, 08:59AM »

When ever I see comments about a "new performer" or new songs and the old ones not being done, I remember the song Garden Party by Rickie Nelson.

I went to a garden party to reminisce with my old friends
A chance to share old memories and play our songs again
When I got to the garden party, they all knew my name
No one recognized me, I didn't look the same


Someone opened up a closet door and out stepped Johnny B. Goode
Playing guitar like a-ringin' a bell and lookin' like he should
If you gotta play at garden parties, I wish you a lotta luck
But if memories were all I sang, I rather drive a truck



A performer has to continue to change both in their performance and teh songs they sing. Listening to the old songs, well that is what CDs are for.

I have only been to one show but have all the cds and DVDs. I look forward to the new CD and DVD
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lifeismusic2009
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« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2009, 09:05AM »

Very well said Rich. I am sure I have said things that I wish I hadn't, but I truly love Celtic Woman and would never intentionally hurt ANY of the girls!!!!!!
And Zo, I think they could rock Row, Row, Row, Your Boat  Cheesy Cheesy
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Zo
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« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2009, 10:58AM »

Very well said Rich. I am sure I have said things that I wish I hadn't, but I truly love Celtic Woman and would never intentionally hurt ANY of the girls!!!!!!
And Zo, I think they could rock Row, Row, Row, Your Boat  Cheesy Cheesy

Yeah, that's why I said they could sing it and I'd love it Grin  (I hate that song ... lol)
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thedoctor
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« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2009, 11:22AM »

I agree with what most people are saying about posting opinions that might disagree with the popular "accepted" view of the group. People can be critical of things without attacking people personally. People have different experiences with Celtic Woman and its members and supporting teams. I think that people should be heard as long as the posts are not personal attacks.

I love Celtic Woman and have since they first came out. I have seen members come and go. I have my personal favorites as do we all. Yet, I have not had the personal glowing experiences with the women of the group as others might have had. I have not been able to meet the girls in person and some of the contact I have had with members of Celtic Woman (past and present) have not been the most heart-felt experiences as others have said theirs were in the forum. It does not have any impact on my love for the talent of the group. The women are human.  

One thing we have to remember is that they are human just like us. They have beliefs and thoughts and express them in ways that some might like and some might not. Maybe I caught them on a bad day or series of bad days or they just dont like me ( I am not easy to get along with). That does not make me want to say bad things about them. I have respect for them and think their image is a positive influence in society. I think that people should hear less positive stories as well so that we remain balanced in our views.

You may disagree with what people say but you should respect it as long as it is done in a way that is not personal attacks and have some substance behind it. Debate an issue, ask questions but do not dismiss anyones post (positive or negative) just because you do not agree or feel that the forum has degraded because of it. It is up to the moderators but I think that a balance of the postive and not so positive should be maintained as long as some rules are followed.

-thedoctor

 
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Kevin R.I.
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« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2009, 12:03PM »

Rich, you have one of the toughest jobs going.....administrator/diplomat. I don`tknow if President Obama could handle it any better.Mild ...and I emphasize that word...critisism of lighting or sound can be tolerated as it will let CW LTD try to improve things for the better. If any member doesn`t appreciate the extraordinary and immense talents of all CW ladies , past and present maybe they should look for other forums. It seems that 99% of the members  here absolutely love our Celtic Ladies.  They`re more wonderful in person  than can be explained. Their Pbs specials are wonderful. I love hearing new numbers that will become old favorites in time.I`ve seen SFTH  8 times in the past week and can`t wait to see it again.
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thanks EVI

Hi Kev, I sneeked into your account as you know, wanted to say: love you!!!!

Love, Evi.
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« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2009, 12:21PM »

off topic p.s.  If you feel your constitutional rights have been violated in any way - you signed away those rights when you agreed to be bound by our membership rules.  This forum is privately owned and administered, and you do not have the right to say anything you want, either in posts or in the chat room.

Oh please tell me there aren't people who actually make the "BUT IT'S FREE SPEECH IN THE ~*~CONSTITUTION~*~!!!" argument on a privately owned internet message board. Please tell me there isn't that much ignorance in this world, lol.
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« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2009, 12:48PM »

off topic p.s.  If you feel your constitutional rights have been violated in any way - you signed away those rights when you agreed to be bound by our membership rules.  This forum is privately owned and administered, and you do not have the right to say anything you want, either in posts or in the chat room.

Oh please tell me there aren't people who actually make the "BUT IT'S FREE SPEECH IN THE ~*~CONSTITUTION~*~!!!" argument on a privately owned internet message board. Please tell me there isn't that much ignorance in this world, lol.


LOL  I wish you could be in my Intro American classes when we get to the civil liberties section.
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